I sincerely hope that visibility on engines is looked at as a whole. You'll never see a seer, for example, using an unholy lion thruster/lion thruster, so why does that engine now have 909 visibility? At that visibility, i physically cannot flick my engine on and off fast enough to avoid detection.

And please, please look at moral emphasis's? xD

I mean, seriously? 6k thrust on a 300 size engine? (Giga ME) It could be a really nice option for snipers if it were done correctly.

can someone test the rhino charge nerf with selen slaves? standard gear and shiz

Current stats on Giga ME (in our SVN) is size: 201, thrust: 7600, turning: 2289. Vis seems to be 666 though, or might be 66...Not sure if Im reading it right. What vis does it have on live?

This might also not be the latest stats, not sure if Jeff has commited his latest changes yet.

http://wiki.starsonata.com/index.php/Engines

Simon says 30.

Yeah, its apparently supposed to be a large stealth engine...but it sucks major balls. My sniper is not exactly turning on a top as it is, and its using a current unholy lion thruster.

In fact...well, i'd kinda like a somewhat major boost over my current engine if i'm going to trade it for one thats twice the size, and doesn't have the +5% speed mod on it...

EDIT: On live atm, the vis is 59. Thats kinda crappily high too, at that point it could be anything up to, say, 500, and still be useful.

I mean, seriously; I am not even using VOLLIES, because the vis gained by them is too much. At that point, unless an engine has a max of maybe TEN visibility, its fairly crappy so far as stealth goes. >.<

Allow us a breif comparison of the lion thruster(a fairly common UZ drop), to the giga moral emphasis(an extremely rare and difficult to scoop DG drop)


Lion thruster/G Moral Emphasis
Tech: 20/19
Size: 180/312
Thrust: 18700/6800
Turning: 6035/2035

Do you see the problem here. We are comparing a common drop that you know exactly where to find it to an extremely rare drop from high end DG's. And the common drop is three times better.

NO amount of visibility could overcome that. In fact, when it comes to engines, IGNORE visibility COMPLETELY! Just balance the engine, and then make up some vis stat that seems to work. Nobody BUT snipers will change their setups around stealth, so just take the engines snipers will like and make them low vis, and have the rest be high vis, its just that simple.

Personally I have found that a vis of 50-100 is low enough. You can be seen if you move with people too close but as soon as you stop thrusting the vis will drop fast.
You cant expect a engine with very high thrust/turning and also very low vis. Once you get below 100 vis it will start effecting other stats.



You are also comparing a low vis engine to a high vis engine. Serengeti gear counts as high end tech 20 gear while the Giga ME is just tech 19.

Im hoping you have read Jeff's post though. The formula for low vis engines is getting changed which will result in a beef to stealth engines.

uhh, voom? Snipers are already getting mauled by SD's, after being spotted from way to far out. A vis 100 engine would get them spotted from, like, 3-4k away or something.

I try to stay somewhat still as much as I can and instead waiting for the AI to get in position I do certain things to get them in position.
If you wish to move around a lot you will probably want to use a much lower vis engine then I need but be prepared to have worse stats.



Personally I agree. UZ has been camped so much that almost all the gear has become very common.



It's really pretty much the same for all classes. If you want the best you are limited to very few items. I will try to make sure that there are atleast 2 different high tech engines for snipers. One really low vis (less then 50) and one semi low vis (between 50-100). The semi low vis one is already taken care of, will be in one of those sniper missions I have mentioned.

I went on test and took a look at the neww LT/PLT, RC/PRC stats, and I can't really see what all you noobs are whining about. The stats were a little broken before and they all seem pretty balanced now. Sure, all my characters have a little less thrust than before, but they are all still playable.

LT's and RC's are such easy to get items, and with the previous stats, they were quite obviously broken.

There are countless ways to improve your agility, you just need to use your head a bit. As RP said, there are 3 bar skills that are in-game to improve your engine and increase agility. You can also get tons of gyro modded gear ie my Rhino Charge*Gyro and T20 shield cap*gyro. And if they ain't enough, there are tweaks called 'Ace in a Pill', use them if your ship turns like a phat phuck. Oh, and Ace in a Pills work amazingly with NT 50, and they're cheap as hell to build., and if you are in a frieghter, there's no reason why you can't fit like a 100+ onto your ship.

no, no, no >.<

You got exactly the opposite meaning that what i meant to convey. IF i CAN move around more, i like to do so, but if i cannot, i'm more likely to just stay still and have less fun.

What you're saying is that if i want to move around, i cant do it well, but if i dont want to move around, i CAN move well. How does that make any sense?

You will have to make a choice. Either you use a very low vis engine that will be a little weaker or you use one with a little more vis and get better stats.

Well in that case you should give sniper -90% engine vis or something.

do you know why i'm complaining? It's because the ONLY class this is hurting is sniper. The ONLY class, is sniper. NO OTHER CLASS IS DAMAGED BY THIS CHANGE.

So why the hell is this nerf necessary?

Excuse me but how exactly is it a nerf?

And keep in mind that vis is messed up on a lot of engines and will get fixed, other then that the actual stats will be beefed....