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Grunt
Team: Rank: Operator Main: Teh Haxzorz Level: 2443 Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 1:58 am Posts: 501 Location: United Kingdom
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Re: Gunner
Sounds like this is a thread born out of the fact that someone is finding it hard to get on an oly squad more than anything.
May I ask what is wrong about gunners using missiles as their main DPS? Or spamming missiles? It's what makes gunner so overpowered imo which is why I'm wondering why people want it to be beefed. When I play gunner, I swoop in, sit in front of the AI like at the minimum firing distance and use my missiles as both DPS AND as a shield. Theyre usually dead within a second orso, and I am without a scratch.
I've levelled up 4 chars alone on my account as gunner to level 1.5k and beyond (read: level 2k+ on one) very easily, and retain a char as gunner with a HF Zebra setup that spams missiles, so I feel I can also speak with some experience. Sure, I don't really go doing ubers in a squad with it, mainly because I have a zerker and a shm that are usually in higher demand. I do have a dread and some EFBC slaves that are well geared for if I ever did decide to do some ubers where I needed to be more tanky.
Anyway, gunner is brilliant for soloing several ubers, running around and doing DG's and PvPing certain classes. And lets not forget how important gunners are in PvB thanks to their mining DPS.
I think if anything, some more missiles of various damage types would be best, like what has been suggested in this thread already, and maybe a vulnerability aura would go some way to appeasing capship gunners who want auras and stuff.
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Fri Sep 09, 2011 4:31 am |
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Camsy
Team: Rank: Peon Main: Camsy Level: 2191 Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2008 6:03 pm Posts: 2214 Location: Sydney, Australia
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Re: Gunner
Idk if this has been covered (can't be stuffed reading 6 pages) but why not allow for Gunner ____ augs to include missile damage?
_________________
Blue Dwarf wrote: Statistically, they haven't changed.
Except for the beef I gave.
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Fri Sep 09, 2011 4:46 am |
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Bluejayek
Team: Rank: Main: Bluejayek Level: 3919 Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 7:16 pm Posts: 1356
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Re: Gunner
Camsy wrote: Idk if this has been covered (can't be stuffed reading 6 pages) but why not allow for Gunner ____ augs to include missile damage?
Bluejayek wrote: One thing that really should exist is + missile ops and + fighter ops stats on augs. It doesn't seem to make sense that both FC and gunner have major parts of there class be unaffected by augs.
I don't think that the stat could just be tacked onto gunner mastery augs however. The aug stats would all have to be rebalanced. I more rather see new augs like the drone ops augs that are based around missile stats but have others as well.
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Fri Sep 09, 2011 5:07 pm |
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Battlecruiser23
over 9000!
Team: Rank: Councilor Main: Churchill Level: 5620 Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 10:36 pm Posts: 11706
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Re: Gunner
My take on Gunner, after interviewing shawn_mccall, Masterful, and Laptop Boy. Quote: *Note, all items can be balanced as needed.
Part 1: Missiles. -All missiles changed to use a Kinetic Missile as a base. Means the max damage comes from going fast. Spammers deprived of ability to deal high spamming damage.
Part 2: Damage. Damage all across the board is increased vastly. A Gunner would do in the range of 75%-80% the damage of a Zerk. With missiles, said gunner can pull 100% the damage of a zerk.
The issue, is that while a gunner could do this kind of damage, the gunner can only do this damage in a capital ship.
The Gunner also must sit at a range to gain maximum punch from their Kinetic missile base.
Part 3: "Aggressive" Capital Ships. A hybrid of a Heavy Fighter and a Capital. Basically, a Heavy Fighter tagged as a Capital Ship.
These "Hybrids" can take the models/graphics already in game from a few Heavy Fighters. Texture/Size is different. Personally, the size should be bigger than current HF's like rosy/zebra/wave, yet smaller than a dread/PBF/BS
Class locked Ships/BP loot can be added as needed, but a T13, T16, T19, T20, and T21 types would exist. Dreads would be seen as Fleet Focus(includes FC) ships.
Part 4: Debuffs. Gunners would have access to Gunner-locked Aura Gens. These do not provide a field, merely take the slot. What they do is change the gunner's debuff from the default destruction to one of a various other kinds of debuffs. Unequipping any equipped gunner aura resets debuff back to default destruction.
_________________ Salt Assault drew this conclusion from the latest devblog. [img]http://oi62.tinypic.com/33208ex.jpg[/img]
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Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:21 pm |
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Griffin
Team: Rank: Main: Stabberz Level: 2414 Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:55 am Posts: 3696
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Re: Gunner
^ This is perfect.
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Blue Dwarf wrote: In space, no one can hear you cha cha cha.
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Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:26 pm |
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treygrey1
Team: Rank: Main: Xenodread Level: 2605 Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 2:43 pm Posts: 413 Location: Ponyville
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Re: Gunner
Churchy that is the most amazing thing I've ever heard. /veryverysigned
_________________ (landswimmer) Jey is like the liquid terminator crossed with ron jeremy. he doesnt stay dead, and he never stops coming.
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Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:35 pm |
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shawn_mccall
Team: Rank: Main: Paladin's Presence Level: 3937 Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:53 am Posts: 6770
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Re: Gunner
I'm with Church.
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Neba wrote: BLACK PEOPLE DON'T GET RICE
andezrhode wrote: goett wrote: All oly ships look way to geometrically conservative for my tastes. thats because most graphic designers are squares
goett wrote: Fired bullets taste like candy.
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Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:38 pm |
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Masterful
Team: Rank: Officer Main: Masterful Level: 6877 Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 2:47 am Posts: 1346 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Re: Gunner
Grunt wrote: Sounds like this is a thread born out of the fact that someone is finding it hard to get on an oly squad more than anything.
May I ask what is wrong about gunners using missiles as their main DPS? Or spamming missiles? It's what makes gunner so overpowered imo which is why I'm wondering why people want it to be beefed. When I play gunner, I swoop in, sit in front of the AI like at the minimum firing distance and use my missiles as both DPS AND as a shield. Theyre usually dead within a second orso, and I am without a scratch.
I've levelled up 4 chars alone on my account as gunner to level 1.5k and beyond (read: level 2k+ on one) very easily, and retain a char as gunner with a HF Zebra setup that spams missiles, so I feel I can also speak with some experience. Sure, I don't really go doing ubers in a squad with it, mainly because I have a zerker and a shm that are usually in higher demand. I do have a dread and some EFBC slaves that are well geared for if I ever did decide to do some ubers where I needed to be more tanky.
Anyway, gunner is brilliant for soloing several ubers, running around and doing DG's and PvPing certain classes. And lets not forget how important gunners are in PvB thanks to their mining DPS.
I think if anything, some more missiles of various damage types would be best, like what has been suggested in this thread already, and maybe a vulnerability aura would go some way to appeasing capship gunners who want auras and stuff. The reason gunners don't get on Oly squads is because people think gunners are useless. In order for gunners to do well in Olympus, you need 2 or 3 gunners, an engi or two for elec and the rest ShMs. Then the gunners just kite the boss out. Personally I want to try it. I heard a gunner can solo one of the Olympus gods... but that is just a rumour...
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Thu Sep 15, 2011 2:43 am |
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zhuang281
Team: Rank: Officer Main: Dark Phantom Level: 4762 Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:24 pm Posts: 1892 Location: In Phatnoms world
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Re: Gunner
As much as i dislike Gunner Capships, missile spamming is not OPed.
1. Pvai :Requires you to get close to said target. At this range, it may be that a gunner can "Solo" an oly uber as DPS with an appropriate supporting squad, i don't know. However, Zerkers and Snipers can also "Solo" oly ubers.
2.It may also be that Capship Gunners have it easy with levelling due to missiles. Each class has its advantages. If you want to be a gunner, you will rarely be pulled along to any uber run. Neither will you be a god in pvp.
3. Pvp: The person moves at 40 speed, your missile spamming tactic at close range is now foiled by the fact the opposition has an engine.
Every class is capable of dpsing and soloing DGs. Take away missile spam, there goes the Capship Gunner DPS and it will be reduced into a hunk of junk. However, im all for limiting such spammage if it means gaining increased abilities/gear for the class.
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Thu Sep 15, 2011 3:02 am |
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Griffin
Team: Rank: Main: Stabberz Level: 2414 Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:55 am Posts: 3696
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Re: Gunner
Hey admins, can we get what Church said put ingame?
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Blue Dwarf wrote: In space, no one can hear you cha cha cha.
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Sat Sep 17, 2011 6:19 pm |
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Masterful
Team: Rank: Officer Main: Masterful Level: 6877 Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 2:47 am Posts: 1346 Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Re: Gunner
zhuang281 wrote: As much as i dislike Gunner Capships, missile spamming is not OPed.
1. Pvai :Requires you to get close to said target. At this range, it may be that a gunner can "Solo" an oly uber as DPS with an appropriate supporting squad, i don't know. However, Zerkers and Snipers can also "Solo" oly ubers.
2.It may also be that Capship Gunners have it easy with levelling due to missiles. Each class has its advantages. If you want to be a gunner, you will rarely be pulled along to any uber run. Neither will you be a god in pvp.
3. Pvp: The person moves at 40 speed, your missile spamming tactic at close range is now foiled by the fact the opposition has an engine.
Every class is capable of dpsing and soloing DGs. Take away missile spam, there goes the Capship Gunner DPS and it will be reduced into a hunk of junk. However, im all for limiting such spammage if it means gaining increased abilities/gear for the class. You left out PvB. Another idea I just had was base missiles. Have an item at Ordnance Command. When this item is equipped on a gunner owned base, any missiles that base fires at another base do 400% damage and hit through resists.
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Sat Sep 17, 2011 7:34 pm |
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zhuang281
Team: Rank: Officer Main: Dark Phantom Level: 4762 Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:24 pm Posts: 1892 Location: In Phatnoms world
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Re: Gunner
Masterful wrote: zhuang281 wrote: As much as i dislike Gunner Capships, missile spamming is not OPed.
1. Pvai :Requires you to get close to said target. At this range, it may be that a gunner can "Solo" an oly uber as DPS with an appropriate supporting squad, i don't know. However, Zerkers and Snipers can also "Solo" oly ubers.
2.It may also be that Capship Gunners have it easy with levelling due to missiles. Each class has its advantages. If you want to be a gunner, you will rarely be pulled along to any uber run. Neither will you be a god in pvp.
3. Pvp: The person moves at 40 speed, your missile spamming tactic at close range is now foiled by the fact the opposition has an engine.
Every class is capable of dpsing and soloing DGs. Take away missile spam, there goes the Capship Gunner DPS and it will be reduced into a hunk of junk. However, im all for limiting such spammage if it means gaining increased abilities/gear for the class. You left out PvB. Another idea I just had was base missiles. Have an item at Ordnance Command. When this item is equipped on a gunner owned base, any missiles that base fires at another base do 400% damage and hit through resists. I left out pvb because of two simple facts. 1. If the base is moving, this makes it exponentially harder to missile spam due to the existence of gremming weapons. 2. Do you really want to get in the way of primal furys?
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Sat Sep 17, 2011 10:35 pm |
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SkyTitan
Team: Rank: Main: Odd One Level: 523 Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:12 pm Posts: 1326
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Re: Gunner
zhuang281 wrote: As much as i dislike Gunner Capships, missile spamming is not OPed. Maybe not. Compare with Lion Incinerators. Missile Spam may not be overpowered in that regard, but, the fact remains, there will be no missiles that can do damage on that level at range until missile spam is removed.Inconsitancies regarding range... pfft
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Sat Sep 17, 2011 11:36 pm |
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Tomzta09
Team: Rank: Peon Main: Mow Level: 9760 Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 2:57 pm Posts: 4731 Location: Kuratovo, Russia
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Re: Gunner
Doesn't it say that gunners have the "biggest and most powerful weapons in the universe"
Doesn't look like it to me!
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Sun Sep 25, 2011 9:01 am |
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Griffin
Team: Rank: Main: Stabberz Level: 2414 Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:55 am Posts: 3696
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Re: Gunner
They should, but they don't. Zerk can both tank and outdps any class. Sniper can provide near the Zerk's dps, has stealth and range. Then there's Gunner, who can barely tank, has lower range than a Sniper, conditional dps, nowhere close the dps of a Sniper or Zerk, a huge ship image size, poor agility, and little alternatives for suitable ships.
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Blue Dwarf wrote: In space, no one can hear you cha cha cha.
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Sun Sep 25, 2011 10:12 am |
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